You’ve probably waited years for your partner to hear you and make the changes you’ve needed. So why does that change now make you feel pissed off? The answer: mistrust is part of the change process. Learning how to manage this mistrust is imperative for couples when they are changing their negative cycle.
In today’s episode join our hosts Laurie and George in a fantastic conversation on what happens to us when our partners start to make the changes we’ve been asking for, for years and why that can cause mistrust. You’ll learn what’s happening in your brain when there is a red light, yellow light or green light in connection and strategies to promote regulation and connection.
Remember, our brains are wired to protect and they want to hold on to the negative information for safety. Leaning into the mistrust and planning for this with your partner as you’re changing together will help you navigate this new territory and be more successful. Therapists looking to get more training on the sexual cycle make sure to head over to our website www.foreplayrst.com to learn more about our training in Nashville this January!
Transcript
Laurie Watson [00:00:00]:
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Laurie Watson [00:00:45]:
That’s o l l I-e.com BFF the best food for your best friend. Hey girl.
George Faller [00:00:53]:
It’s us, your hormones.
Laurie Watson [00:00:55]:
And we’re throwing a late night pop up rave called Night Sweats. Sorry about your ventilation system. Hot flashes. Too lit. Things are wild. Do you feel it?
George Faller [00:01:08]:
Do you feel wild? Good thing there’s an Amazon One Medical.
Laurie Watson [00:01:13]:
Office nearby so you can get seen and feel seen.
George Faller [00:01:17]:
Amazon One Medical healthcare just got less painful.
Laurie Watson [00:01:22]:
This episode is brought to you by. Oops. I’ve got a box of Cheez It Crackers staring at me and I just wanted that irresistible Cheesy Crunch. Sorry, that was a total snackcident. Mmm. What was I supposed to be talking about? So salty.
George Faller [00:01:37]:
So crunchy. So cheesy. Whoops.
Laurie Watson [00:01:42]:
Lost my train of thought. I’ve heard of brain freeze, but brain cheese? Mmm. I’ll just have one more Cheesy cracker and then I’ll get back to it.
George Faller [00:01:52]:
The following content is not suitable for children.
Laurie Watson [00:01:55]:
Welcome to the school of Love.
George Faller [00:01:56]:
Let’s do it. Our chance to break down the therapy process so you can do it at home without the therapist. All this focus on getting these withdrawals to re engage. But we gotta have a plan for the pursuers at the same time. What the hell are we gonna do with them?
Laurie Watson [00:02:13]:
Lori, I know you gotta help us. Welcome to Foreplay sex therapy. I’m Dr. Lori Watson, your sex therapist.
George Faller [00:02:23]:
And I’m George Fowler, your couples therapist.
Laurie Watson [00:02:26]:
We are here to talk about sex.
George Faller [00:02:28]:
Our mission is to help couples talk about sex in ways that incorporate their body, their mind and their hearts.
Laurie Watson [00:02:36]:
And we have a little bit of fun doing it right G Listen and.
George Faller [00:02:39]:
Let’S change some relationships. Timing is everything.
Laurie Watson [00:02:43]:
That’s exactly.
George Faller [00:02:44]:
I remember my mom telling me I would always want to get something to talk about something. She’d be like Timing’s everything, George. Focus on timing. Is this the right time?
Laurie Watson [00:02:55]:
So good advice.
George Faller [00:02:57]:
Good advice.
Laurie Watson [00:02:58]:
Mrs. Fowler.
George Faller [00:02:59]:
Mrs. Fowler.
Laurie Watson [00:03:00]:
Nice.
George Faller [00:03:01]:
So timing. Laurie, this is, we’ve been spending a lot of time on how do we get these withdrawals emotionally and sexually to stand up for themselves, to stop kind of going away. We get going away feels safer in the moment. But the cost of going away is you’ll lose yourself. And they need to start kind of reemerging and standing up. But while they’re trying to do that, we have to have a plan for the pursuers who they got their own stuff that wants to be addressed and they kind of are going to jump into this process, not focus on the mission. There’s going to be a lot of obstacles that we want you all to be prepared for. Now, when you have these conversations, it’s not going to go smooth.
George Faller [00:03:38]:
Right. When this withdrawal tries to reengage, the pursuer is typically going to do what they do, which is try to take the microphone.
Laurie Watson [00:03:45]:
Yep. And as a pursuer, I’m well aware of those feelings that happen when my partner has reengaged with me both emotionally and sexually and kind of what I go through. And so I, I, I think I can help here.
George Faller [00:04:00]:
All right, well, let’s give that context. I think the first thing we’re trying to get pursuers to see is the mission in this moment is for the withdrawals to have success. You have your own stuff that’s super important, and we’re going to get to that, we promise. But it’s not this timing to actually talk about your stuff. You’re trying to give the microphone over to the withdrawer. So that’s. Do they buy in? Because if pursuers don’t buy into that, then the withdrawal shouldn’t re. Engage.
George Faller [00:04:30]:
I mean, you really need that, that joint agreement that in these next couple of minutes, this is the withdrawal’s time to let us into their world. Right. And it’s going to bring up triggers for the pursuer, which we’ll talk about how to help pursuers with that. But really just starting off with the mission, the mission is this is not the time for your stuff. Pursuers.
Laurie Watson [00:04:51]:
Exactly. And this is, if you’re just joining us, this is when your partner starts to change. When they’re re engaging, it means they’re starting to change, basically doing the things that you want and have maybe longed for, wanted, asked for. And I think what comes up is, oh, is this going to last? Is this going to be, this is going to be just a show because I’VE been begging for it, or I’ve been angry about it. I mean, all this stuff comes up inside us as pursuers watching the change, and we get anxious and we have doubt. We mistrust our partner doing the thing we want. It’s so crazy, right? How many times have I sat with people who, when one partner starts to change, the other person just kind of throws up their hands and says, I don’t even know if I can go there anymore. You know, because this is just, you know, you just doing what the counselor says, or you’re just doing it because I wanted you to, or, you know, and it’s like, exactly.
Laurie Watson [00:05:53]:
They’re doing the thing that you have wanted. And how do we manage those emotions as those pursuers, as we’re watching the change so that we don’t blow it? Because if we express all this mistrust and we throw the doubt, you know, on the process, right? It’s almost like we’re an anchor against change. We keep us in that same old loop, and we don’t actually support the change process, but we got to deal with these terrible feelings because certainly all of us have felt that, like, okay, I’m risking one more time, but what’s the end result? You know, maybe nothing will really change.
George Faller [00:06:33]:
Exactly. I usually try to help partners and couples prepare for three possibilities that we can call a green, yellow, or red light, right? This is these. This is what could happen. So if I’m the witcher and I’m trying to share, and the mission is me, I want Laurie to be ready for three possible triggers of my sharing, what it could do for her. You know, the first would be a green light that she’s actually open and empathetic and something I say touches her, right? So we want those green lights for her to share those things. Those are the things that create healing and more safety. Yellow light is more of Lori has some empathy, but some mistrust. This is probably the most common thing, right? Lori is gonna be like, I feel so sad.
George Faller [00:07:20]:
You’ve never really shared this, but why have you never shared this? Right? It starts to kind of introduce something new, right?
Laurie Watson [00:07:27]:
I’m so glad we’re having sex, but what about all these 20 years that we haven’t had sex, right?
George Faller [00:07:32]:
So when that yellow light starts to come up for the pursuer, really, really want them to kind of close, validate their own mistrust, to say, this is important, but this isn’t the right time for this because, yes, I want to talk about this later, but right now, George Is engaging. Right. He’s doing what I want. Let me turn that into a green light. I’m going to honor that yellow light. I’m going to give it some voice to myself, but I’m not going to give it the microphone. I’m going to kind of stay focused on George.
Laurie Watson [00:07:59]:
Right, right.
George Faller [00:08:01]:
And we’re expecting that. Right, Lori, that you’re going to get that. That word but is a classic one that tells me we’re at a yellow light. Right?
Laurie Watson [00:08:08]:
Yep. We’re in a yes but stage.
George Faller [00:08:11]:
Thank you for initiating. But, you know, we still only had sex, you know, once this month. And it’s like that, but erases all the empathy that you were kind of sharing. So really, the pursuer has to have a plan for their own butts, to be able to apologise, say, you know what? That’s not the right time. I’m sorry. Keep going, George.
Laurie Watson [00:08:30]:
Yeah, and it’s possible that we could also have a red. A red light. You know, experience when our partner has to change.
George Faller [00:08:38]:
Right.
Laurie Watson [00:08:38]:
You know, we could feel rage and like, okay, already, you know. Yeah, now you’re saying these things. But, you know, it’s hard. I think, too, you know, sometimes what you hear may be the difficulty, especially maybe sexually or with, you know, emotionally. Some of the things you hear are just like when they start to actually tell you what’s living inside them. There’s surprise, there can be fear, there can be all kinds of things that trigger you as a pursuer to receive that new information. So, I mean, it’s. It’s not easy.
George Faller [00:09:14]:
It’s important for you to recognize your own red light. Because if you’re in a red light space, you gotta ditch the mission. We’re no longer safe for that withdrawal to open up and to kind of engage. Right. You’re too caught up in your own stuff. You need to force the mission because now you need the microphone, you need the attention, and you’re, you know, you’re taking the mission somewhere else. And, you know, I really want couples to be a. This is where couples fail all the time because we think we’re doing withdrawal re engagement.
George Faller [00:09:42]:
And I say, yeah, I would want more sex, but, you know, sex with us is too quick. And now all of a sudden you hear too quick as I’m blaming you, and you’re like, what are you talking about? Maybe it wouldn’t be so quick. We have sex more often before, you know, it lit up and you’re making it all about you. And, like, I want to just go away. Right. To which or wants to back down because. And now we’re back in a negative cycle. So these red lights are likely to happen.
Laurie Watson [00:10:06]:
Exactly, exactly. So we want to help people know what to do. You’re saying the green light when you, when they say things that you’re like, oh, this is so good to hear. Say that. Yeah, this is so good to hear. I’m so appreciative of you sharing this. I’m so appreciative of you sitting down and talking with me, opening up. I’m so appreciative that you, you know, wanted to have sex tonight and asked me and you know, or plan something new or wore something new or I mean all of that.
Laurie Watson [00:10:36]:
Anything we can possibly give that we is genuine in our heart about this feels good. We want to give it. I want to say it right there.
George Faller [00:10:46]:
That’s how we complete the mission which yours have to have success. Green lights, they have success. Right. So no, that’s the target. That’s we can’t always be in that place. And that’s human. We got our own stuff. But when it is, when you’re open and you’re empathetic and you’re able to keep your focus on your partner, that is gold.
George Faller [00:11:02]:
That is healing. That is the stuff that creates positive cycles.
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Laurie Watson [00:12:57]:
The doubt piece in the process. If you’re in conversation with your person who is doing something great, even if you have doubt, we want you to keep it inside for a little bit so that your partner can, you know, feel safe to make this change. And I mean, especially if there’s been a long pattern of uninvolvement sexually or a long pattern of, you know, not sharing emotionally, that can be so tough because you want to just blurt it out. You want to blurt out that, yes, but why now? Or why haven’t you done this before? All those things. And, I mean, I think we want to offer you comfort. We know that that doubt is there and it is so painful to hold.
George Faller [00:13:45]:
It inside, and it has to be addressed. It’s important we’re not forgetting about it. Yes.
Laurie Watson [00:13:50]:
Eventually.
George Faller [00:13:51]:
Not in this moment are we dealing with. With it.
Laurie Watson [00:13:53]:
It’s bad.
George Faller [00:13:54]:
Sneaks out. If it sneaks out for you to take ownership. Right. If you say, you know, your partner finally initiates and you’re like, yeah, thank you. Because normally you don’t. Like, they’re going to sneak out because they’re so used to saying those things. Right. But when you do, to say, you know what? I’m sorry I said that that wasn’t the best timing.
George Faller [00:14:12]:
Maybe sometime we can talk about that. But right now you’re doing it. You don’t deserve a message that reminds you all the times you don’t do it when you’re actually doing it. Right. I mean, that’s the terrible timing in this. Like, take ownership for that. Right. You have good reasons for it.
George Faller [00:14:25]:
But don’t let that tell. Tell a story.
Laurie Watson [00:14:28]:
Say, I’m sorry and. And probably know that that’s going to shut down your partner again.
George Faller [00:14:33]:
Yeah.
Laurie Watson [00:14:33]:
You know, it’s probably going to shut down the moment if you let the dis. The mistrust out.
George Faller [00:14:38]:
You’d be amazed how much Rose like the pursuer saying they’re sorry, you know, instead of them always being the one wrong for. With that Pursuer. I had a couple say it the other day in session. The pursuer’s like, I did it again, didn’t I? I just. I just snuck that in. I’m so sorry. Like, who the hell would want to have a conversation with me if I’m sneaking those things all the time? I’m so sorry. The witcher is like, yes, thank you.
George Faller [00:15:01]:
This is like exactly what I needed. That kind of. That level of protection. So this is. This is. This is super important. Then. You got those red lights, right?
Laurie Watson [00:15:10]:
Yeah. If you have a red light. If I were in red light. And maybe what you’re saying brings up fear in me and my body is dysregulated. How could I gently let you know that I want to continue this conversation later? Maybe you make an excuse, say, you know what? I just remembered I gotta do something at work and I want to talk about this at another point. Could we talk this evening? And you go and you get yourself reregulated. You go talk to a friend, something so that you don’t blast your partner with that red light energy of. Or just the huge resentment of maybe it’s been so long since it’s happened.
Laurie Watson [00:15:55]:
And you just, you know, whatever the emotion is that puts you into a red light, which a red light experience would be. You know, my blood pressure escalating. You know, I feel really in my body. You know, maybe I want to blast with anger or criticism or something. Yeah.
George Faller [00:16:13]:
And listen, it happens. It’s human. It’s really hard to give the microphone to your partner for them to express their pain. When you have all this pain that’s never addressed, it’s never paid attention to. It doesn’t feel fair. And your body wants to protest that. So, like, this is gonna happen. And that’s why we want you to have a plan for it now, to recognize it, to say, you know what? I wish I could listen to you, but I can’t because too much is happening for me.
George Faller [00:16:35]:
Like, if you could take a timeout or whatever you can do to kind of just say, mission stopped and we’re no longer doing which roaring engagement. There’s just too much happening here. And sometimes couples decide to switch the mission to let the pursuer get a little bit of help so they can reset and ground themselves and they could kind of come back to refocus in on the withdrawal. Right. This is where you might need the help of a therapist to be this bridge that’s able to. To kind of help you reset. But just, we want you all. I mean, it’s the hardest thing for couples.
George Faller [00:17:06]:
And they have open hearts and they want to go into these conversations and they have no plan for when they get triggered. And what we’re saying is you’re definitely going to get triggered. You can’t talk about these most vulnerable places and for it not to hit you in your raw spots. So when those raw spots happen. Well, let’s, let’s try to have a plan now when we’re in green clean brains instead of when it’s too late and we’re flooded and dysregulated.
Laurie Watson [00:17:29]:
Okay? So let’s, let’s come back and maybe give an example of what this would look like. So let’s do an example, George, for everybody. Maybe this time we’ll switch it up a little bit. You can be the sexual withdrawer as a male and I’ll be the sexual pursuer. And you are re engaging. And I’m going to go through kind of green, yellow, red lights and I’ll show what we do with it kind of. And then I’m going to do a little aside for our family that’s listening, you know, what I’m actually going through inside and what my strategy is to manage those different states of mind.
George Faller [00:18:17]:
Right. So last few episodes we’ve talked a lot about emotional and sexual withdrawal reengagement. And that is the mission here. For that to work, the pursuer has to have a plan for these likely triggers. So this is just our way of giving you some options and then we’ll just play with it. This could be the emotional conversation, it could be the sexual conversation. Right now we’re going to just do the sexual. So I’m going to start us off.
George Faller [00:18:42]:
So, yeah, I mean, I think it’s hard. So let’s change our names. We’re not Joey and Maria. Who are we? We’re a different couple. A lot of different couples out there that have different patterns. We guarantee they all have some pattern. Right, Just different patterns for sure. So I’m Rick and I’m trying to re engage here.
Laurie Watson [00:19:06]:
So I’ll be Nancy.
George Faller [00:19:08]:
Yeah, Nancy. I think it’s hard, especially being a guy. And I don’t know. I have so much pressure. I know you want to have more sex and I know I start to wonder what’s wrong with me, why I don’t want to have sex. And I know pressure is not good for me. Then I feel more pressure and then I’m like. I feel like I must be broken.
George Faller [00:19:33]:
There must be something wrong with me. My penis isn’t going to work, I’m going to let you down. And then I feel terrible about myself.
Laurie Watson [00:19:40]:
Hmm. I. I’m grateful you’re talking about this. I mean, I really feel good that you want to talk about this. And I think usually I’m the one that pushes the conversation. So thank you so much for bringing this up. That. That’s the part of me.
Laurie Watson [00:19:58]:
An aside that is genuinely glad that.
George Faller [00:20:03]:
We’Re talking and not to over complicate this, but sometimes when the partner is open and empathetic and a green light, because I don’t get a lot of experience with that, it could cause my mistrust. I don’t know how to take that in and receive that. So, again, we. We want to just recognize that it’s this combination between openness and empathy and defensiveness is like, you know, we all have some of both and trying to slow down the process to kind of have a plan for when that happens as withdrawals. I want to help my withdrawers be ready to not trust responsiveness. Right. Because they normally don’t have success in these places. And instead of that, meaning they’re failing to just say no.
George Faller [00:20:45]:
This is a normal part of change. But again, notice how. How Nancy is keeping the focus on me and she’s genuinely kind of curious about what I’m sharing. It sucks that I’m in pain, but she wants to know more because she don’t want me to be alone in that pain. And this is normally a place I keep to myself.
Laurie Watson [00:21:04]:
Exactly.
George Faller [00:21:05]:
And for male sexual withdrawers, who are often emotional withdrawers, you know, this is a place they often never let anyone into. Right. This is their own little dark closets they keep to themselves. So they’re going to take this risk and they’re going to actually let their partner in. It’s super important that pursuers recognize the timing of this risk.
Laurie Watson [00:21:25]:
Right. And okay, let’s do a yellow brain response.
George Faller [00:21:30]:
All right.
Laurie Watson [00:21:30]:
Or at least I want to explain what goes through. So I think I’m going to.
George Faller [00:21:35]:
Let’s keep it going from this conversation. So, you know, thank you for, you know, being open, like, because I often feel like in these conversations, you know, you’re always the judge, you’re always critical, you always have all the answers. And, like, I’m just this screw up all the time.
Laurie Watson [00:21:54]:
Yeah, yeah, I. So I would not want to express my yellow brain here. I want to stay empathic with him, but I will tell you yellow brain thoughts.
George Faller [00:22:09]:
So hit me with a yellow brain.
Laurie Watson [00:22:13]:
You know, I know, Joey, you know that there is so much pressure at work. But, honey, you don’t take enough time for yourself. You don’t take enough time for us, and you worry about your penis. But I don’t. So what I would be saying is I’m taking the focus off of my withdrawal. I’m not really in his experience anymore. I’m fixing it. I’m trying to use my energy to manage this whole situation because it’s still that frustration, right.
Laurie Watson [00:22:43]:
It’s like I’m not letting him do his own work. It’s like I’m trying to take over.
George Faller [00:22:49]:
And for most pursuers, this isn’t a choice, right? Laurie, it happens so fast. It’s like you are feeling empathy. It’s like you feel this. This problem. And it could so easily be fixed if I just prioritize. Better.
Laurie Watson [00:23:02]:
Yeah.
George Faller [00:23:02]:
So again, your brain has lots of reps at trying to fix this problem and give advice. So it just sneaks into these moments. But the time is going to be terrible if you’re going to tell me that I don’t prioritize. Right. If you criticize me exactly. When I’m taking my heart out and trying to hand it over to you, I’m going to pull away as quick as a flash.
Laurie Watson [00:23:21]:
Right. And. And if I’m so reassuring about whatever this problem is with your penis, I don’t really get to know you. I don’t get to know, like, what you go through in this moment. And so it still remains a mystery to me. And I can’t share the burden with you. It’s like I want to fix it so bad. I don’t want you to feel bad about your penis.
Laurie Watson [00:23:43]:
You know? And it’s just like, it’s. But it doesn’t really help this conversation.
George Faller [00:23:49]:
Right? It shuts down the conversation.
Laurie Watson [00:23:51]:
Shuts down the conversation.
George Faller [00:23:52]:
So it’s gonna sneak out. So let’s see how you would repair that, Laurie. How you would kind of.
Laurie Watson [00:23:57]:
Okay, so if I said all that and. Joey, maybe you are shutting down.
George Faller [00:24:01]:
We’re gonna try to stay with Rick just so we don’t confuse everyone.
Laurie Watson [00:24:03]:
Rick?
George Faller [00:24:04]:
Yeah.
Laurie Watson [00:24:05]:
So, Rick, you would be shutting down. So. Rick. Okay, I’m doing it again. I know. I do that. And you say I do that. You said I always have all the answers.
Laurie Watson [00:24:14]:
You just told me, and I just had all the answers again. And I’m sorry. You know, I. I don’t. I really do want to understand what you’re going through. I’m gonna. If we could just have a little do over here. I want to put my stuff aside and could you Go back to what you feel about pressure.
Laurie Watson [00:24:32]:
And maybe I blew it. Maybe we need to start this another time. But I want to understand what the pressure is like and what you worry about with your penis. I. I don’t really know.
George Faller [00:24:43]:
Awesome. Again, that reset, taking ownership. I can feel myself as Rick being like, wow, that’s different. Like, that’s hopeful. Like, there is some interest here about me because I don’t really know me either. I don’t know how I feel about my broken penis. Right. So if I’m willing to start letting her in, I really need her to stay safe and focused on that.
George Faller [00:25:03]:
And I can feel her curiosity opening up here.
Laurie Watson [00:25:07]:
Okay.
George Faller [00:25:08]:
So, again, that was really nice. Just have a plan before this conversation happens. It’s likely, if you’re a pursuer, you’re gonna have some mistrust. You’re gonna want to get some advice, and you’re going to shift the focus. You’re going to add something new. That’s the most common thing pursuers do. Like this. Yeah.
George Faller [00:25:24]:
But, like, can’t you see? Like, when we go on date nights, it’s eat. Like, they just want to add, and. And there’s truth and it’s important. Everything they want to add. It’s just not the right time.
Laurie Watson [00:25:34]:
Yeah. Although as a pursuer, I like talking about buts. That’s. That’s a good thing. Okay. Okay. So let’s do a red light experience.
George Faller [00:25:45]:
Yeah.
Laurie Watson [00:25:46]:
So he’s talking, and Nancy goes into red brain.
George Faller [00:25:49]:
Yeah. So we just repaired, and now I’m going to keep going. Right. The goal is to be able to have a plan to turn these yellows back into green or even red to come back to green at some point, because green is what we need for success. Right. That’s going to be mission accomplished. So you. Thank you, Nancy, for, you know, acknowledging that.
George Faller [00:26:09]:
Like, I think that’s kind of some of my reluctance to have these conversations. It’s like, not only am I trying to share my struggle, but then you remind me of all my other struggles, and I’m like. It’s like an avalanche. I’m like, screw this. Like. And then I just go back into this place where I feel defeated, I feel discouraged. I feel like I’m never going to be the man. Maybe you want someone else that there’s.
George Faller [00:26:34]:
You know, I guess who I am is just never going to be enough for you.
Laurie Watson [00:26:40]:
Oh, my God. I just cannot go down this road. I have told you a thousand times, I want you. And it’s like you just. No matter what I say, you just don’t take it in. I just don’t get why we have to like why you have so, so much low self esteem.
George Faller [00:26:57]:
Help get me out of here, right?
Laurie Watson [00:27:01]:
And so with Venmo Stash, a taco.
George Faller [00:27:04]:
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George Faller [00:27:28]:
See terms at Venmo Me Stash terms.
Laurie Watson [00:27:33]:
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George Faller [00:28:29]:
So very human thing to do, right? But if you look at the time and the impact, like the intent is healthy. Nancy just wants to say, like, come on, how many times have I beat my head up against this and tried to comfort your fear? And it’s back again. I hate this thing. It’s what blocks us, right? So she should be annoyed at this, right? But look at the impact for me, if I’m actually trying to let her into my world where I’m struggling now, she’s going to blame me for not not being able to be, feel more confident. Like my defeat. It just got times 10. And I want to jump off a cliff and just get his. Get out of dodge.
Laurie Watson [00:29:05]:
Yeah, exactly. And as a pursuer, I’ve probably got, you know, 12 other things I want to Say that are in red brain. You know, I’ve got lots of complaints here. Even as he’s coming forward. Like, did you go to the doctor about your, you know, penis problem? You know, like, lots and lots. And, you know, if. If you de stressed, you wouldn’t be on high blood pressure problem, there wouldn’t be a penis problem. You know, I mean, I could just go on and on and on.
George Faller [00:29:34]:
This is what the drawers call piling on. This is. It’s. And. And Nancy, you can feel how she wants to introduce all these elements that are impacting this place. Right. But it’s just gonna. It’s gonna smother me.
Laurie Watson [00:29:47]:
Yeah.
George Faller [00:29:47]:
So how can you catch that?
Laurie Watson [00:29:49]:
Yeah. So, I mean, I think what I need to say is I need to listen to little Mrs. Fowler inside says, this is not the time. Yeah, I know you’ve hurt over this for a long time because I imagine, you know, also an empathic Mrs. Fowler who’s saying it’s not the time, but gets why I want to do it, why I want to say these things, and gets that sex is important to me and all of that, but it’s not the time. And it’s like, there will be a time. I can certainly hold on to some of these angry, doubting, problematic fears that come up, frustrations, and just. It’s like, it’s not now.
Laurie Watson [00:30:31]:
It’s not now. This is a moment when my partner is talking to me, and I want to give them the success of being receptive to them. So I got to hold on, you know, I. I got a phone call with somebody, you know, a girlfriend that I can let this all out with at another point.
George Faller [00:30:50]:
This might also be the time where you just ditch the mission and give me permission to pull away.
Laurie Watson [00:30:56]:
Yeah.
George Faller [00:30:57]:
Right. So for you to be able to say, you know what, too much is happening for you, and, you know, you’re not able to keep the focus on me, and you want to be able to do that. So maybe we just take a break here. Right. And withdrawers appreciate a break. They appreciate a reset.
Laurie Watson [00:31:11]:
Sure.
George Faller [00:31:12]:
Right. But it’s not likely to be successful to keep this conversation going when the pursuer is dysregulated, flooded, and drowning in their own stuff.
Laurie Watson [00:31:22]:
So maybe I just say, you know, I love that you’ve brought this up. I want to be able to listen to you and focus on you. And what I’m finding inside right now is these distracting thoughts, and I’m not going to be able to come back to you the way I want to. Is it okay if we talk about.
George Faller [00:31:39]:
This after dinner, again, these are the hardest moments. This is why people don’t have these conversations. It’s when one person’s taking a risk and they’re in a green brain and their partners are in a red brain, flooded, dysregulated. And this is. This is what causes negative cycles and mistrust. And they’re vicious. And it happens to all of us. It happens in our personal relationships.
George Faller [00:32:00]:
We’ve just gotten better at anticipating them and having a plan. Most people just have no plan. They’re hoping it’s going to go well, and they have no plan for the likely mistrust that is going to happen in these conversations.
Laurie Watson [00:32:12]:
Right.
George Faller [00:32:13]:
So if you’re in a relationship, you’re going to have these moments. Talk about it now. So you both, you know, this doesn’t mean you don’t love each other. You’re trying to reject the mistrust. You’re trying to reject the hurt. You’re not trying to reject your partner in these moments. And, you know, that’s what we’re trying to get people to be ready for.
Laurie Watson [00:32:29]:
Exactly. Okay, so red brain, yellow brain, green brain, if possible, when you’re withdrawing partner, sexually or emotionally is coming forward. If you’ve got empathy, say it. If you’ve got doubt, hold it. If you’re in red brain, probably, you know, come back together at another time.
George Faller [00:32:53]:
Yep, I like it. Clear strategy.
Laurie Watson [00:32:56]:
Thanks for listening.
George Faller [00:32:59]:
Timing is everything.
Laurie Watson [00:33:00]:
So some of you are interested in our work. We want to tell you where we.
George Faller [00:33:04]:
Are, what we’re doing in January 23rd to 25th. We’re coming to Nashville in person to do three days of really kind of breaking down this process. And again, I think this should be mandatory for all therapists to just kind of have more confidence in knowing what to do and work with the sexual cycle.
Laurie Watson [00:33:21]:
Yeah, we’ve already had lots of signups for that. By the way, George, people are also taking advantage of that early bird special. You know, we want supervisors to come. We’re giving half off to the supervisors. So please join us so that we can kind of get on the same page and understand and develop EFT further. There’s going to be two days of lecture and exercises, and then a day maybe with a live and, you know, working on your tapes and your stuck places. And we’re gonna go down to the Honky Tonk and have dinner together and have some fun.
George Faller [00:33:54]:
Have some fun.
Laurie Watson [00:33:55]:
Have some fun. Yeehaw.
George Faller [00:33:57]:
Yeehaw. And for all you listeners, again, if you have a community and you want Laurie and I to come out and give a specialized training on sex. And again, I think this is so important for anybody seeing couples. Then, you know, reach out to us and let’s continue to spread this message. Yeehaw. Call in your questions to the four play question. Voicemail. Dial 833 my four play.
George Faller [00:34:21]:
That’s 833 my the number four play and we’ll use the questions for our mailbag episodes. All content is for entertainment purposes only and should not be considered as a substitute for therapy by a licensed clinician or as medical advice from a doctor. This podcast is copyrighted by Foreplay Media.
Laurie Watson [00:34:37]:
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Laurie Watson [00:35:22]:
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