Welcome Brave Lovers! In today’s episode, we are discussing boundaries. The term boundaries can be found everywhere now on social media and today we are breaking down what healthy boundaries are and are not. There is a lot of misinformation on boundaries and we are here to set the record straight!
Join George and Laurie as they discuss what healthy boundaries in a relationship sound like, how to say no with care and how these guardrails protect and support your relationship. You’ll also learn more about rigidity and defensiveness disguised as boundaries and how to work yourself out of this dynamic. What do boundaries mean to you and how do they show up in your relationship?
Remember to pre-order a copy of our book now! Brave Love, Great Sex available on September 15th.
Check out this episode’s sponsor (and help the ‘pod!):
uberlube.com – Laurie’s long-time favorite personal lubricant. Use the code ‘bravelove’ at checkout to receive a discount!
Transcript
Laurie Watson, PhD (00:21.792)
Okay, George, we gotta talk about boundaries. And you know, many people when they say this it sounds like the other person is trying to control them. But we’re really gonna talk about how boundaries protect connection, right?
george (00:35.496)
Beautiful.
Laurie Watson, PhD (00:40.014)
Okay, we have our book coming out on September 15th. pre-sales really help us because then that counts for our first week of distribution. please find that on Penguin or Amazon or anywhere books are sold at this point. Brave Love, Great Sex, Harnessing the Oops, what is it? Harnessing attachment theory for shit.
Harnessing attachment theory for passionate relationships.
Laurie Watson, PhD (01:18.126)
I did not get mine. That’s so great. exciting. Ooh. Cool colors.
george (01:24.414)
Check it out, people. Cool colors.
george (01:30.766)
I think boundaries is such a misinterpreted word in so many relationships because you know boundaries can be used as punishment and you know, I need to get away from you and put up this wall and I don’t wanna have sex with you and it it a rigid boundary.
Laurie Watson, PhD (01:31.115)
Okay.
george (01:49.754)
is not what we’re talking about at all, right? rigid boundary comes from defensiveness. It’s just part of negative cycles. And it creates more distance, right? So a lot of people when they think boundary, they think walls, they think that. And that’s really not what we’re talking about.
Laurie Watson, PhD (01:52.312)
Yeah.
Laurie Watson, PhD (01:56.823)
Right.
Laurie Watson, PhD (02:02.251)
Right. And I really think that I hear it used a lot with like, well, you’re crossing my boundary, or I have a boundary about that, which basically is saying, I don’t want to do that. And i it’s something or another that, you know, if you’re crossing it, you’re really, really hurting the person. And you may not even know they had a boundary or you know, what that boundary means to them, or you know, I’m trying to protect my boundaries. It’s like
Sometimes I hear this used and it’s it’s discouraging to me because it’s this this lingo and somehow or another, you know, you’ve you’ve hurt somebody already because you’ve crossed their boundary. I that’s that’s tough.
george (02:44.731)
Yeah, and that’s that’s discouraging, right? And it it pathologizes boundaries. I think a better word for that is just defenses, right? When when you tell somebody, Hey, you know, don’t talk to me that way, I mean that that that reactivity, don’t talk to me that way, typically gets the other person defensive, right? They hear the anger, the frustration, the tone. That doesn’t sound like a healthy boundary, that sounds just like an attack.
Laurie Watson, PhD (02:53.633)
Mm-hmm.
george (03:12.273)
Right, not saying it’s it’s not good to put up a boundary, but you could just translate that differently and say, Hey, can we find a way to talk about this where we both feel respected? Like that’s an invitation to the partner instead of an accusation to the partner. So again, how we present these boundaries is super important.
Laurie Watson, PhD (03:12.641)
Yeah.
Laurie Watson, PhD (03:29.495)
Sure, sure. and I I mean I noticed when you said that you didn’t even say the word boundary, but a lot of times people do, especially in current culture, use the word boundary, like you’re you’re crossing my boundary. And it’s like, I I don’t really know what that means. I don’t know what you feel, I don’t know, you know, what I’m supposed to do different. It just like suddenly there’s this defensiveness in me of like, my God, what did I do?
george (03:42.842)
Mm-hmm.
george (03:59.304)
Yeah. So it’s a shutdown and that is not what we’re talking about. And and a lot of this comes from the attachment science of what caregiving is. And we Lori and I have been talking a lot about the caregiving system. And the caregiven system, you know, everyone thinks it’s all about love and empathy and support and all that ooey are beautiful stuff. But you know, it’s like a seesaw. Half of it it’s love and limits. The other part is being able to put up
Laurie Watson, PhD (04:00.973)
It’s a shutd it’s a shutdown.
george (04:25.371)
Boundaries, structure, consequences, discipline. I mean, we need to fit into the world. That’s how we operate. So, how do you put up a boundary that says, you know, this is what I need to feel safe? I mean, boundaries are actually clear communication that keeps the relationship safe. Like we have a commitment to, you know, a monogamous relationship that is part of the boundaries that both people are agreeing upon, right? And when that’s respected.
Laurie Watson, PhD (04:49.163)
Right. Even if even if they agree implicitly, right? Because a lot of couples come in, maybe they’re dating and they’ve been dating for three months even. And then suddenly they’re the the partner finds out, my partner’s still dating. And it’s like there was an implicit agreement about monogamy, like we’re together. so I mean I think certainly in those a stages it needs to be clear, but by the time we’re married
You know, we stand up in that big white dress and promise fidelity.
george (05:21.809)
Yeah. And isn’t that just simply a boundary? It’s saying both of us are agreeing upon something, shared values, shared meaning, a vision of what our relationship looks like. And this boundary actually helps protect the relationship. And that’s the beautiful thing about healthy boundaries is they protect the relationship. That’s why they’re there. They’re not there to punish each other or control each other. They’re there to say, hey, listen, we want to protect the emotional bond. And these are the ways we do that.
Laurie Watson, PhD (05:24.544)
It’s a boundary.
Laurie Watson, PhD (05:32.866)
Right.
Laurie Watson, PhD (05:39.264)
Mm-hmm.
george (05:50.654)
You know, if you have a boundary that says we don’t really we try to not go to bed mad, right? We have a boundary that says even if we’re angry and we’re not on the same page or we can’t repair in this fight, we still say goodnight to each other. We give each other a kiss. You know, that that that boundary again protects the state of the relationship.
Laurie Watson, PhD (05:50.804)
Exactly.
Laurie Watson, PhD (05:55.105)
Yeah.
Laurie Watson, PhD (06:08.831)
Nice. Do you and Kathy do that, even when you’re mad?
george (06:12.653)
we do and that’s more of Kathy’s she started that early on. It’s good to develop good habits, you know. So I I grew up in a family where it was okay to go to bed mad and just you know, that’s everybody was mad at different points and it wasn’t that big deal. But in her family she really wanted to make sure that that didn’t happen. So that was really a beautiful early boundary that she put up and
Laurie Watson, PhD (06:28.044)
Yeah.
george (06:35.601)
We agreed upon it in a calm state, right? And when we’re getting along and say, This is what we want to do. Shoot towards this. And even if we’re mad, can we just say goodnight? I love you. We’ll figure this out tomorrow. And you know, developing those habits was a really helpful boundary for us.
Laurie Watson, PhD (06:38.229)
Mm.
Laurie Watson, PhD (06:50.933)
Yeah, I love that. It’s just a little touch back to say, You’re still important, even though I’m mad at you. I think that’s beautiful. I do I don’t think that people should talk late at night about their issues. You know, nothing good happens after nine PM in terms of talking about our problems. But but I think that this is a way, a little ritual, a little boundary that says, but we’re still important to each other. So even if we’re
george (06:58.502)
Yeah.
george (07:19.453)
Yeah, and then that right, but and that’s another important boundary. If you’re the one that says I can’t talk, it’s not the right time, then you make a promise to circle back when it is. That’s just a simple boundary. You can’t just say I don’t wanna talk and then never tr talk about it, never bring it back up. That’s that’s a betrayal of the agreement, the boundary that the couple’s putting up to protect both.
Laurie Watson, PhD (07:20.564)
Super mad.
Laurie Watson, PhD (07:28.023)
Mm.
Laurie Watson, PhD (07:42.126)
Sure. I think when I hear the word boundary, just naturally inside, I hear limitations. But the boundaries can be very, very, very, very wide, right? It’s like this is our safe place. This is where we become important to each other. I mean, they they like in the bedroom, right? We have a boundary maybe about others, but within this space, it’s protected. So it’s like a super highway.
You know, yes, there’s guardrails, but what we can do in here is we can go really, really fast because we’re safe. Does that make sense? Yeah.
george (08:16.237)
Exactly. Yeah. The Godrails is such a a h helpful image. They’re not trying to prevent the couple from controlling each other. They’re trying to help the couple actually have more safety. And that’s a really different reframe to boundaries, you know, for me growing up
Laurie Watson, PhD (08:20.813)
Mm.
Laurie Watson, PhD (08:30.284)
Mm-hmm.
george (08:32.669)
classically trained seeing boundaries don’t cross my boundary like as an assertion of self and differentiation. And there’s some really important, beautiful health in standing up for yourself, but how do you stand up for yourself in a way that also protects the relationship? And that’s where the communication becomes so important.
Laurie Watson, PhD (08:47.337)
Exactly. Exactly. And I’m not saying that people should not have internal places that they don’t want disrespected and that they should communicate that. Absolutely. But we’re gonna talk about how to communicate that so that it protects the we, the relationship, you know, and including in your thinking, how do we sort of
have the most that we can have. And I think Kathy’s ritual there and her boundary of saying, We’re not gonna go to bed. I think it’s not that you’re not gonna go to bed angry. It’s that you’re not gonna go to bed completely disconnected. You know, you’re still going to prioritize the relationship with that kiss and that saying, I love you.
george (09:30.664)
Yeah. And part of a boundary also is consequences, right? And if your partner says
Please don’t be late. And the other partner comes home late and then says, I’m sorry, and does it the same thing the next night and the next week and the next month and just continues to do the same action that hurts you and you keep communicating, please don’t do that. And they’re like, Yeah, I hear you. I’m sorry, I won’t do it, and keeps doing it. I mean, something’s gotta give a boundary says, listen, how how do we do this differently? That’s the definition of insanity. We keep doing the same thing, expecting different results. Like that boundary is saying something needs to change, and if not.
Laurie Watson, PhD (10:03.137)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
george (10:10.577)
Then I’m not gonna make dinner. I’m not gonna wait for you. I’m gonna do something to protect myself from a behavior that keeps hurting me.
Laurie Watson, PhD (10:18.507)
Right. I I can’t wait dinner for you when I have hungry children and you’re late. So we’re just gonna go ahead and eat. That’s that’s the logical consequence of the person being late. Is like, okay, I need to get on with my day. I’m not going to wait for you. Or I mean sometimes, you know, I’ve had couples who say, you know, my partner takes forever to get ready. They’re often
A half an hour past the time that they’ve agreed on to be ready that we need to leave to get to the event, you know, to be on time. And I feel really, really anxious when we’re late. So that may mean we take two separate cars. Honey, take as long as you want, right? It doesn’t have to be angry. It’s just like I have this need to be there on time so that I don’t feel that dreadful feeling walking in late. You have a need to get ready. And if you’re not ready when we’ve agreed.
george (10:59.857)
Yeah.
Laurie Watson, PhD (11:12.983)
To leave, that’s fine. That’s fine. I’m gonna go ahead.
george (11:17.597)
Yeah, and I really like how you use that example. It’s the consequences that to live it in love, not in this punishment is meant to like you’ve looking at parent and it’s meant to spy a motivate change. It’s not supposed to be to hurt people.
Laurie Watson, PhD (11:31.229)
Right.
george (11:33.543)
Right, that we love. So how do you stand up for yourself that says, This is kind of what I need and this is what I’m gonna do and I really need you to respect that. Instead of us fighting and turning into a negative cycle, that we’re just gonna agree to do it a little differently here.
Laurie Watson, PhD (11:33.964)
Right.
Laurie Watson, PhD (11:39.149)
Yeah.
Laurie Watson, PhD (11:47.936)
Right, exactly. I had a client whose husband was a road rager. And it became scary for her to drive with him, you know. George knows nothing about that. nothing. And I’m like, Why do you drive with him? It’s like, Well, we’re going to the same place. It’s like, right, but by the time you get to that place, your nervous system is shot because you’ve been enduring this road rage.
george (12:00.145)
No.
Laurie Watson, PhD (12:14.571)
Why not drive two separate cars? Or why not tell him, you know, I’d be lo love to go with you as long as I’m the driver. You know, and I mean, there’s ways to figure this out that say I don’t need to deal with your bad behavior or your behavior that threatens me in some way, right? but I don’t have to say, You need to stop being a road rager. It’s like, okay, that that’s sometimes kind of
part of the other person’s nervous system, they get so triggered on the road, they can’t control it. You know? And so it’s like, okay, I can
george (12:48.397)
It’s the worst thing when your nervous system is activated to have your partner then turn on you and tell you you’re doing it wrong. So, you know, and I if you notice, not to protect road rages, but you know, are a lot of people out there as they get older.
Laurie Watson, PhD (12:54.751)
Yeah. Yeah.
Laurie Watson, PhD (12:59.607)
Ha ha ha.
george (13:04.231)
They get more and more scared of the simplest little things, you know. So you’re going over fifty-five, your partner’s like, You’re going a little fast. It’s like, come on, I’ve been driving for 40 years. I I think I know how to drive. Can you need and this is what exactly what we’re talking about. The fears, the need to feel safe, the way it’s communicated comes across as criticism, control, messages, you’re doing it wrong. And I love that Lori, I just want to put an exclamation point on that. Like using the
Laurie Watson, PhD (13:07.617)
Yeah, yeah.
george (13:32.603)
The we word is such a a shift in the dynamics to be able to say, Hey, how could we do this again? We’re in the car. I’m not feeling safe. You’re probably not feeling so great. Like, how do we do this differently? How do we put up a boundary here? Maybe that boundary means we could need to be in separate cars, or maybe we could figure out how to be in the same car together. But it’s it’s working towards the we instead of this separate individual stuff.
Laurie Watson, PhD (13:45.303)
Right.
Laurie Watson, PhD (13:56.994)
Right, exactly. I I I’m gonna give one more example of boundaries, that I suggested. I had a client who
george (14:05.319)
Can we can we do that after the break?
Laurie Watson, PhD (14:08.633)
yeah, let’s come back after the break. Talk about another example.
george (14:12.773)
Right, go for it.
Laurie Watson, PhD (14:14.465)
So I had a client whose partner probably was an alcoholic or was using alcohol to quite an extent. And they had a lake house and they would go up there and he would get with his buddies and get wasted, you know. And the scary thing is he would drive the boat with the children in a drunken state.
george (14:33.393)
Mm.
Laurie Watson, PhD (14:34.285)
And, you know, they would often drive over to a restaurant at the other side of the lake and then, you know, he’d have a few more drinks and she’d be on pins and needles, like, my God. And the other thing is, is that meant that, you know, the whole evening, the whole next day, right? He was drunk in the evening and she really wasn’t connected to him. The next day he was hung over, so he wasn’t she wasn’t connected to him. I’m like
Whatn’t and she’s like, the the bad thing is my children are witnessing this behavior too. And I’m like, Why don’t you just go home? And she’s like, Well, if I go home then how is he gonna get home? I’m like, Well, you know, how about Uber? She’s like, Well, it’s an hour and a half. I said, How about Uber?
george (15:04.765)
Right.
george (15:17.193)
Yeah.
Laurie Watson, PhD (15:18.571)
You know, I mean, that’s not your problem, or you take two cars up to the lake so that you have an you know, an escape, or when you’re at the restaurant and you see your partner drinking a couple more and you know that the only way back, you know, is gonna be the boat, like you call the U Uber there or you hire a boat taxi, or like like the the sense I think of helplessness when you’re caught in a cycle and you just feel like we need to keep doing this thing.
george (15:44.338)
Yeah.
Laurie Watson, PhD (15:47.072)
And she felt like she needed to control his drinking, right? That that was the thing she needed to do. Like, no, no, no. You can’t control his drinking. That’s on him. But you can control being in his presence and having the children in his presence. And it’s like, for heaven’s sakes, go home and just say, you know, you know, it’s just not a healthy environment right now for us to be with dad. And she’s like, Yeah, but what if he would drive the boat drunk when I wasn’t there? I’m like, He’s driving the boat drunk when you are there.
george (15:50.226)
Yeah.
Laurie Watson, PhD (16:15.965)
You know, it’s like you can’t stop this. And it it’s like I I asked him, how much is the Uber home? And she’s like, probably a hundred and fifty dollars. I’m like, how much is my fee? You know, my fee is more than a hundred and fifty bucks. I don’t know. So save yourself some money. Right. Anyway, I mean that’s a boundary, right? Without saying you’re so bad and terrible.
george (16:30.407)
Save yourself some money. Yeah, I mean for boundaries to work, right. For boundaries
For boundaries to work, you really need both people to take ownership for their actions. You know, so we don’t want to make this sound easy. If you’re in a relationship where your partner’s not taking ownership for their drinking, their violence, their affairs. I mean, we people do bad things. They make they make mistakes. And if you could own that mistake, like that’s what boundaries are helpful for. Like you need to own that mistake. You need to make amends. We need to kind of repair and rebuild trust. Right. If one person’s not willing to do that, like this it
It’s not gonna work. And the other partners left with no choice but to put up a more rigid boundary that is saying, all right, since we can’t protect us, then I need to protect myself.
Laurie Watson, PhD (17:19.405)
Sure, sure. Right, exactly. If the agreements about going up to the lake, you know, are okay, we’re only gonna have two drinks or you we’re not gonna drink at all and that keeps, you know, not happening, it’s like, yeah, then you have to say, Okay, the best way I really still think it’s about protecting the relationship. The best way we protect us is for us not to be together when you’re drinking, you know. Or I mean certainly
You know, people say, I mean, there’s terrible things that happen, right? Where you do need to say, Okay, you know, you’re in an arrage, the children are now awake. It’s like I’m gonna take the children to a hotel for tonight, you know, until you can calm down. And then you just go and do that. I mean, that’s that’s appropriate to protect the two of you and I mean, gotta do that.
george (18:15.697)
Yeah, and that’s the only thing you can control, you’re right. There’s so much helplessness. But then you wind up being in this position of trying to do everything perfect to get your partner and and your partner’s not actually taking the ownership they need to do for the behaviors that are not making the relationship safe. So let’s let’s talk about the bedroom. Yeah.
Laurie Watson, PhD (18:31.723)
Right. Exactly. Okay, let’s talk about the bedroom. Yeah. Let’s get to the bedroom exactly.
george (18:37.947)
I think the what are the and this is how do we change it from an I language to the we language? Maybe we could practice with this. But the most common one we see is where one partner says, I don’t want to have sex, which we agree is a healthy thing to do. To to make yourself have sex when you don’t want to have sex is not a good thing. It drains the body, you know, to just have more pressure, more shame, more kind of stress. You know, so we love the boundary that says, you know, I this isn’t the right time for me. But you also have a
Laurie Watson, PhD (18:45.901)
Okay.
Laurie Watson, PhD (19:07.06)
Exactly.
george (19:07.891)
partner who’s now being rejected, who it is the right time for them, you know, and they’re part of the we. So we have to be able to put up a boundary for us while still protecting the other partner. That’s really what good boundaries do.
Laurie Watson, PhD (19:18.071)
Yeah. Right. How do we find something where both of us and our needs are held in respect and with care, right? The caretaking cycle, which says, okay, I care about my needs. It’s not my right time. I I don’t want to have sex, heavens, when I’m exhausted, or you know, it was just too tiring of a day, or my body is just bloated and sick. I don’t want to do that. And so it’s fine to say no.
But also if your partner is horny or has desire or or wants you, it’s like with respect, it’s like, Hey, buddy, I so appreciate that you want me today when I’m exhausted. you know, I’m dead meat right now. How about we do this in the morning? Like respecting their need. Yeah.
george (20:05.629)
I see this so often with couples that go on like a week vacation. Like they go into the say the the wife’s parents house to stay. You know, the wife’s got all the stress that the kids are there, you know, the they’re with their parents are there, you know, they she’s overextended. She right, she has to do all this extra work and she’s like last thing she wants. And meanwhile, the husband was working like crazy, finally has a week off of work, is you know, help it out, but it’s around all the time and you know, just spending a lot more time with your partner.
Laurie Watson, PhD (20:19.649)
They’re cousins, they’re siblings.
george (20:35.583)
So it’s just normal for a guy to say, hey, let’s find a little time for, you know, a little love make it, right? Us and that that bond. So it’s just a setup. It’s just a math equation. No one’s doing anything wrong. But how do they get creative and put up a boundary that protects both of them?
Laurie Watson, PhD (20:39.87)
Us? Yeah.
Laurie Watson, PhD (20:46.699)
Yeah.
Laurie Watson, PhD (20:50.739)
Exactly. And not just guys feel that too. Women can feel that as well. The the joy of being with your partner on a vacation and being close to their body and all of that. You just like, whoo. Okay, some of us. but I think what you’re saying Okay, let’s hear that story.
george (21:04.143)
I do have a quick story for that. I I was just seeing well, it’s just the opposite, ’cause I thank you for pointing that out. I mean, a lot of times, you know, I had a wife the other day say, Most of the time I’m not I don’t have desire. You know, it’s only after my period, like a two day window where I actually really want it. You know. Unfortunately when I want it, ’cause the week before I was on my period, we haven’t had sex. He’s so frustrated with me. We’re always in a negative cycle by the time that window opens up for me. But you’re again a hundred
Laurie Watson, PhD (21:22.093)
Mm.
Laurie Watson, PhD (21:33.258)
Exactly.
george (21:34.057)
100% right. What if those two days happen on vacation where where she really wants that intimacy? It’s being driven by her body. You know, and now again this negative cycle stops the couple from having what both of them want. That’s such a sad loss.
Laurie Watson, PhD (21:49.59)
It’s such a sad loss. And of course, we know that talking about it, and especially with a si with a menstrual cycle, right? The same thing happens every month. I mean, this is not brand new news. This is something that we can actually count on to say, look, okay, week of my period, not as into it. But those two days when my period ends, I just want you to know that classically, I’m into it.
And I mean, I don’t know why men don’t track menstrual cycles. Like why you wouldn’t put it on your calendar? Okay, my partner is here. There are apps that track this. And then you know, okay, you know, my my partner’s right as rain. She’s every twenty-eight days, which is classic. Not necessarily everybody’s like that, but very classic. And it’s like you kind of know, okay, like let’s plan that vacation the twenty-ninth day.
george (22:42.524)
Yeah.
george (22:47.023)
It’s wisdom. Lori’s dropping wisdom here, people.
Laurie Watson, PhD (22:49.441)
Yeah. Okay. Well I
george (22:53.639)
Well again, so if you how do you say no? And maybe we role play with Joey and Maria, where you can say no but do so in awareness. I mean from our perspective, right, as as therapists, we’re always trying to get people to protect each other. Stand up for yourself, be able to kind of
Laurie Watson, PhD (23:00.503)
Okay.
george (23:11.345)
But then you have ownership to circle back. You know, maybe you’re not in the mood, but you want to jump in the shower and, you know, help your partner out quick. I mean, there’s so many creative things that a couple can do, even if they’re saying no.
Laurie Watson, PhD (23:19.745)
Yeah.
Laurie Watson, PhD (23:24.565)
Yeah. So I I mean I I have one little example too for the bedroom. I had a girlfriend who was never going to have anal sex. I knew that I’d known her since she was young. Her partner was all about anal sex. And he brought it up every time they were making love. So it became unsafe for her. And she had a lot of desire. And she liked sex and she was playful in bed. You know, and finally she had to say,
Essentially as a boundary. Like, look at I want to bring so much joy to you. I want to be with you in bed. I like sex, but my body starts to guard when I am worried that you’re gonna bring up anal sex and we’re gonna get into a cycle and I’m gonna have to say no. Because my my body wants to say yes, my heart wants to say yes to you.
But there’s this anxiety now that has entered into just starting to have sex with you. And I find myself rejecting you because I don’t want to go through that cycle. And so that was her boundary. And she needed to say really clearly, I don’t want this. And I’m never gonna want this. And I I know right how hard this is for you because this is so exciting to you. And I wanna find something that is at least comparable to you, that is also exciting.
You know, because I I want to do you in a way that you feel alive.
george (24:52.837)
And what was that?
Laurie Watson, PhD (24:55.211)
I I’m not exactly sure what they found. I I wasn’t in on that part of the conversation. But I th you know, I think there are things, right? This is secure couples. When one person says no to something that the other person goes, Okay, I get it. You know, let’s find something else that is equally exciting.
george (25:00.733)
All right.
Laurie Watson, PhD (25:25.589)
Right. Okay, let’s Joey and Maria.
Laurie Watson, PhD (25:39.231)
Yeah. We often go over it though. And I I don’t wanna
Laurie Watson, PhD (25:46.593)
Ha ha ha
Laurie Watson, PhD (25:59.34)
You know, Han, I I I would be up for it tonight. I just want you to know that. So this is a yes. But I I one of the things that when you put it that way, like a little action, I don’t feel desired. And so there is a block in me, you know, that it’s about you getting off or something, you know, a little action. It’s just a little course for me. It’s not a it’s not romantic.
I don’t know, could you find a way like to say it to me in a way that is about me? you know, and w we’ve talked about this in the past and I know I get mad sometimes when you say it like that. but I just want you to know I’m up for sex tonight. I’m just asking you to consider that this is this is the start that we often have that I get turned off on.
Laurie Watson, PhD (27:02.977)
Yeah, I I love that. But it doesn’t even have to be so emotional. It can still be sexual, like, you know, hey, hey, you know, I I’m looking at you and I really want you. I mean, I like your sexual energy. It’s just like a little action, just I don’t know, it I’ve told you, it kind of just feels like we’re in high school and it doesn’t feel as good to me. You you bring great sexual energy and
Yes, but it doesn’t have to be as soft as what you just said in terms of emotional lead up. I mean, it can be very sexual. I just the action maybe it’s just the word, a little action. I don’t know, it just it doesn’t work for me.
george (27:41.406)
Yeah. Well again, to be fair, a lot of the words I use don’t work. I call you hot or sexy. A lot of times that don’t work either, so but I I do get the the piece that ’cause I do want you and that’s really what I need to just communicate, right? That
I I just you do look great and just and you could just as you walk across the room, my body comes alive and I just, you know, I I wanna connect with you. It just makes me feel so good when we’re when we’re in that space together.
Laurie Watson, PhD (28:16.479)
All of that works. All of that works. I love that. What you just said totally works for me.
Laurie Watson, PhD (28:26.999)
Okay. I I w let me tell one more story. I had a friend who you know, she had she was low libido and her partner was like, he’s apparently he went out in the backyard and they didn’t have children at home or anything and he pulled down his pants and kind of wiggled himself. And I’m like, that’s that’s so dumb. Like thinking that she was gonna be turned off.
george (28:27.453)
Get rid of, get rid of that line of let’s let’s get naked or have some action. Right? It’s too transactional.
Laurie Watson, PhD (28:56.683)
You know, and they were telling us this story and she’s like, Why? I really like that. I’m like, Whoops. Hand to hand that’s great. If that works for you, go for it. You know. I was trying to I was trying to coach him and protect her, but that was that actually worked. So what was that like to hear the as Joey? What was that like to hear kind of the the rebuff?
george (29:02.001)
Yops. All right. There you go. There you go.
george (29:21.007)
I think it was fair and Joey wants to have better words. It’s just I think this is why we have to have these conversations because a lot of his attempts to find better words have not worked either. So, you know, the we need reps and people change. What might have worked last year won’t work this year. And this is why this is an ongoing conversation.
Laurie Watson, PhD (29:31.327)
Right.
Yeah. Yeah. And I think that in so many cycles I see, George, you know, one partner has been shut down a lot. And so when the other partner is kind of coming online and trying to adjust, you know, so that it works better, it’s like you know, I I s hear the same rejection that I’ve always heard. I’m not saying it right. And
I think Maria was trying to say, there’s a lot of lot of latitude here, a lot of room. You know, and maybe she was changing in terms of that there were things he could say that were very sexual that would work for her and she was just nixing out the word that caused her nervous system to go, that’s not sexy.
george (30:05.585)
Yep.
george (30:23.131)
It’s a perfect example of a healthy boundary. She’s trying to communicate for the us so the us has more success. You know, and that’s why both partners, Joey, the people listening have to see that as an opportunity for better information. So
Laurie Watson, PhD (30:29.9)
Right.
Laurie Watson, PhD (30:36.321)
Right. And I think that she was saying, We’re on tonight. So it wasn’t like he was left anxious, like, here comes the cycle, it’s gonna wreck it for us. Right. It was like, No, we’re we’re on. I just I’m making an adjustment here so that it’s better for me.
george (30:53.745)
Bad way to end. We’re on.
Laurie Watson, PhD (30:55.615)
Yeah. Thanks for listening.
george (30:57.553)
Keep it up.
Laurie Watson, PhD (30:59.915)
Say keep it hot one more time.
george (31:02.014)
Keep it hot, y’all.
