Hello Brave Lovers! Join us today in our conversation on how to self-regulate when you are in conflict with your partner. We often discuss the power of co-regulation; when partners can be there and ease the distress of one another. However self-regulation is a powerful and necessary tool when your partner isn’t available or their attempts to soothe you become a step in the negative cycle.
Listen to Laurie and George today as they share how to self-regulate, when is a good time to use the skills and what it looks like in practice. Self-regulation gives us the opportunity to reflect on our behavior, the impact it has on our partner and what the underlying need is.
Our book, Brave Love, Great Sex is out on September 15th. Make sure to pre-order your copy on Amazon today!
Transcript
Laurie Watson, PhD (00:23.935)
Okay, George, we talk a lot about the cycle and how one person’s reactivity is caused by the other person’s trigger. But sometimes we got to think about like, what is our own individual responsibility to resolve the cycle, right? What do we do? And I think it’s really important to think about. So what do you say?
George (00:48.522)
Individual accountability, I like it. Bring it on, Lori.
Laurie Watson, PhD (00:52.267)
Okay, George, September 15th is coming close and Brave Love Great Sex is going to be published.
George (01:01.589)
Yee-hoo!
Laurie Watson, PhD (01:02.967)
We are on Amazon now, so please find us there. And we would love your support in buying the book. That really helps us build up for, you know, a big pop when it’s actually published. So thank you very much. If you could look for it there, we would be much appreciated.
George (01:22.318)
In this book, you know, we’re both a bit not huge self promoters and let our work do the talk for us. But, you know, we really believe in this book and how it helps couples really make sense of what happens inside and outside the bedroom and how they influence each other. And there’s so much these conversations that most couples are not talking about that we’re very convinced that if if you read this book or you recommend this book to a friend,
They’re to get something meaningful out of it that they can really in real time apply to their relationships. And that is our mission to strengthen connections. And this is, we think, a great tool in doing that.
Laurie Watson, PhD (02:01.653)
Yep. And my best girlfriend, who was part of our editing team, said, Lori, it’s going to help people. She’s not one for superfluous kind of praise. And that really made me happy. You know, so.
George (02:15.63)
Yeah, I gave you another little shout out from Kathy, my wife who doesn’t really want to talk about these things, especially with her friends. You know, when she read through the book and she was doing some, some proofreading and stuff. She’s like, you know what? I can see my, my book study reading this book. was like, whoa, wait a second. I never talk about topics like that. It’s all like historical things. And I’m like, all right, something if this is exactly who we’re writing.
Laurie Watson, PhD (02:35.14)
Laurie Watson, PhD (02:44.329)
If your wife says a thumbs up, that is really high praise.
George (02:48.43)
Well, that’s, you know, even a name, great sex, know, brave love, great sex. A lot of times people get freaked out and they think it’s all this. It’s about your relationship and communication. That’s really all it’s about.
Laurie Watson, PhD (02:58.343)
It is. And it’s about the importance of both parts for our relationship, you know, to our bond. Yeah. So, and I think it really does. It traces a couple, particularly one couple throughout the book and kind of their process, their problems. And that’s the way I like to read. So that’s the way I really thought to write it was an example. And so another really important person, Gurit Birnbaum,
God love you, gave us a recommendation and endorsement. And she said to me, I love what I read. And that even above her endorsement to me, like spoke to me. was like, I’m so happy, you know, that she loved it because she’s, you know, the most important researcher on sexual attachment and relationships. So thank you. Thank you, Curate. Love your work.
George (03:53.176)
Yeah.
George (03:56.632)
when people can help out and you have a way of spreading a message and there’s any way that we can help with that, please reach out to us because we really think this is a big deal.
Laurie Watson, PhD (04:08.007)
Exactly. gee, let’s, you know, sometimes what happens, I just want to give an example that when I’m working with a couple, you know, they desperately want to be held and understood and validated by their partner for their viewpoint, which all of us desperately want that right and need that. And I’m not minimizing that. But there is another part to
growth and development as people and as a partnership where we too have to kind of think about what our part in the cycle is and what we can do about it.
George (04:52.941)
Exactly. mean, just like inside the bedroom outside influences other so those interpersonal and intro psychic, right? What happens between partners and what happens within them is all part of this picture. And so much we emphasize the interpersonal, right? Interdependency where, you know, Joey doesn’t want to fight. So it makes sense why he goes away. And then when he goes away, Maria feels rejected and she tries to get him to engage and she gets angry and like, you know, so there’s a feedback loop that’s
the cycles and so much of our listeners are familiar with that because that’s so much of what we talk about, but it’s not the whole story, right? There’s also both partners have to look at and take ownership. love that word for, you know, the good intent. Yes. So why they’re doing what they’re doing, but also start to see the impact. Like, what does this do to my, not only my partner, but what does it do to me? To me, that’s like a newer part of my work, really trying to get people to see.
Laurie Watson, PhD (05:26.743)
Right. It’s not the whole story.
George (05:49.58)
that these protective moves, which give them some short term, you know, protection really come at a cost. They come at a cost of their partner. So I think Joey can see how going away kind of makes Maria feel rejected, but does Joey really get to see the cost to himself of going away? But does Maria really get the cost of her own anger? That’s, that’s a whole nother area. We know the most successful people focus on what they can control and your own actions take an ownership of it as a big part of it.
Laurie Watson, PhD (06:05.995)
Yeah.
Laurie Watson, PhD (06:17.493)
Yeah, exactly. You know, I lost my temper this week. And I don’t lose my temper very often. you know, I’ve been dysregulated about losing my temper for three days. You know, it just, I mean, it doesn’t feel good inside. It doesn’t feel good to lose control. And certainly I can blame the person that I lost my temper at, but…
But more importantly, it’s like, it’s me. It’s like, my gosh, you where did all my skills go? Where did all my everything just kind of went out the window in this triggered moment. And, and it’s my responsibility, you know, and it’s also like, it makes me feel crappy. Like, you know, rather than sort of slowing it down, listening and stuff, I, just set a snap thing, which is not usually like me, but I did.
George (07:05.677)
Mm.
Laurie Watson, PhD (07:15.599)
And I just think there’s something in here like where I would have loved to have been validated. I would have loved to have been seen for what my point was. I too, you know, contributed in a huge way to the cycle by losing my stuff.
George (07:33.101)
Yeah. Well, I appreciate you sharing it. It’s a good example of it’s so easy to focus on the other that triggered the place and all our energy goes there instead of also looking at ourselves, right? Which is trying to understand what led to our response. What can we do differently? Even if our partner does the same thing over and over again, right?
Laurie Watson, PhD (07:41.622)
Mm-hmm.
Laurie Watson, PhD (07:48.011)
Mm-hmm.
Laurie Watson, PhD (07:55.861)
Yeah, exactly.
You know, I was talking with somebody else too, and they were saying, kind of like, I don’t want to have to regulate myself. I want to co-regulate. That’s the whole point in working together in a marriage is I want to co-regulate each other. I’m like, I know, but sometimes, you know, it would be ideal, right? If we could always co-regulate each other. And I think that that is the
the fantasy hope coming out of childhood that our parents were really settled and calm and attuned and were able to regulate us as children all the time. But, you know, children are difficult and as parents we lose it. And so that doesn’t always happen. And so we grow up without that inner regulator inside, which is what a good childhood does. It’s like we internalize our parents’ ability.
to regulate us and we became good self regulators. But sometimes that didn’t happen, you know, because our parents were not so great or they blew it enough and we’re just like, you know, now I have to manage my own temper. I have to manage this part of me that gets fearful and wants to pull away. And my partner isn’t able to in that moment either. So, I mean, we have a choice. We can say, okay, we can let the negative cycle take us or we can grow internally with more maturity.
you know, to regulate ourselves.
George (09:28.44)
They’re both important, co-regulation and self-regulation. But to me, the process is still the same. It’s like you’re able to slow down. You’re able to send a clear signal about what is your struggle, what is threatening you. And you can respond to that with caregiving. Like we can do that to ourselves too. Right? So if we get angry and we lose our shit and we’re not our best self, which happens, right? Which happens to all of us.
Laurie Watson, PhD (09:39.713)
Thank you.
Laurie Watson, PhD (09:45.963)
Mm-hmm.
Laurie Watson, PhD (09:49.399)
That’s what I wanted to say. You know I wanted to say that.
George (09:55.757)
Right. can afterwards reflect upon that and say, what stopped me from, you know, what can I do differently, regardless of my partner, if that person could do something differently. Cause that’s true. That’s part of the equation, but also looking at yourself. Like, you know, when I, when I look at my own anger that happens so quick, right. It’s a yellow brain response, a fight response. A lot of times it’s not even a choice. just happens, but we want to make it a choice. Yeah. No, never, never get angry.
Laurie Watson, PhD (10:20.637)
come on, you don’t get angry. Never. Yeah, right. Me neither.
George (10:25.154)
Right. But that, what that anger, the intent is you’re going to, you’re going to get somebody to see you and listen to you and, and see how unfair you’re being treated. Right. It’s an assertion of self. Right. So we see the intent, but the impact besides making the other person feel scared, which it does. Right. What does it do to us? Right. Like you said, you had three days to try to recover from this event. Right. So the cost to you were pretty big.
Laurie Watson, PhD (10:33.462)
Mm-hmm.
Right. Right.
Laurie Watson, PhD (10:44.427)
Yep. Right.
Laurie Watson, PhD (10:50.739)
I I haven’t been sleeping. Right? Yeah.
George (10:56.532)
So if you’re able to take ownership for that to be able to, or I can take ownership for when I kind of lose it, it’s an ability to say, what felt good in the moment really isn’t appropriate because it makes me feel, it gets me further away from my own vulnerability and truth. The thing that hurt me or scared me or whatever threatened me is not being talked about.
Laurie Watson, PhD (11:18.391)
Mm-hmm.
George (11:24.694)
And therefore I abandoned myself. If what I feel the person is doing is not listening, what I’m doing to myself is really not listening. My anger gets me away from me.
Laurie Watson, PhD (11:35.307)
Right, right.
George (11:37.176)
So how do I take ownership and say what feels like in a moment safe, like it’s giving me a voice is actually taking me away from what really is at the heart of the issue. And therefore I’m not going to get what I need when I deal with protecting myself this way.
Laurie Watson, PhD (11:52.309)
Yeah, exactly.
George (11:54.731)
I just want to say that again, because to me, this is the heart of it. It’s like. What feels like protection actually will keep out the very thing that you need to feel safe.
Right. That need it, that need that’s that, that causes the protection, right? I’m scared. Something’s happening. I feel treated unfairly. Like there’s a wound, there’s a hurt. That place is needing help. And yet when I use anger to be heard and I push the other person away, I leave myself, I leave that vulnerable place inside me, not being responded to, not being seen the very thing I don’t like somebody else’s not listening to me.
Laurie Watson, PhD (12:07.979)
Say it again. Say it again.
Laurie Watson, PhD (12:22.903)
Mm-hmm.
George (12:37.386)
is me not listening to myself.
Laurie Watson, PhD (12:39.415)
Exactly. It does make sense. Something’s hurting on the inside. And maybe, you know, your body is reacting and you can’t quite get a hold of it fast enough in your mind. But you abandon the self when you just like kind of fly into the temper because what you really need in that moment is some deeper understanding.
George (12:41.55)
that make any sense?
George (12:47.98)
Mm-hmm.
Laurie Watson, PhD (13:09.683)
I think, George, that our body is key here to not leaving ourselves, to differentiating, right? That if we can get the signal from our body, which is maybe sick to our stomach or blood pressure escalating or whatever, it’s like that’s the flag that says something’s going on here. I need help. I need help. You know? And it’s almost like I think for me, I just got to shut my mouth at that point.
George (13:32.91)
Amen to that.
Laurie Watson, PhD (13:39.861)
so that I can think. Okay.
George (13:40.12)
Well, let’s come back. Let’s come back. And this is so important to build upon the body.
Laurie Watson, PhD (13:44.457)
Okay, let’s do that.
George (13:49.175)
Alright.
So I love, Lori, how you’re highlighting the importance of slowing down and listening to your body. If you can ground yourself, if you could just take a moment to listen to what your body’s saying, you’re getting back into the present moment.
Right. And there’s so much good information that’s stored in our body because the body is going to tell us where the threat is. Right. Every time I’m angry, if I would take that moment and maybe we can’t do it and it happens too fast, but afterwards there’s never an, it’s always a good idea to return to the body. It’s returning to the body is going to give you the information to start doing it a little bit differently. Returning to the body is not leaving yourself. It’s not focusing on the outside and somebody else. It’s really trying to get to the heart of the problem.
Laurie Watson, PhD (14:33.559)
Exactly. In therapy, you know, I’m always asking people, where do you feel this in your body? And the first time you ask those questions to people, they’re like, what? I’ve never even put this together. What do mean? Where do I feel it in my body? You know, they don’t even connect what they’re thinking, what their emotions are with what is actually happening in their body. So it can feel really weird. But over time, they start to realize, yeah.
every time I feel triggered into my survival mode, I do feel I have a reaction in my body. And I think for me, you know, one thing I learned when I was young, when I was managing my temper, most of the time was like, when I would feel that flesh in my face, I knew it was time to get behind a door. Like, I, to me, it was like I needed
George (15:10.754)
Mm-hmm.
Laurie Watson, PhD (15:32.105)
some quick separation from whatever was happening, you know, so that I could self-regulate and I could manage. wouldn’t, something wouldn’t fly out of my mouth. I often tell people, you may not be able to control what’s flying out of your mouth, but you can move your feet. And sometimes it is just kind of best to get out of there before you say something, you know, that was, and then over time,
George (15:56.706)
Yeah.
Laurie Watson, PhD (15:59.295)
I actually was able to hold my temper and I didn’t have to leave in order to manage it. And I’m not saying withdraw and leave without saying anything, try to say, I need a second, you know, so that when you get behind a door, you can do it.
George (16:10.338)
All right. Let’s, let’s take, right. Let’s take some time. So we’re talking a lot about anger. Let’s talk about the other, the right, the flight response, the other yellow brain move and do the same thing. How do you take accountability and ownership? Yes, we know in the moment it feels safer to walk away. That’s what your body is craving a little bit of space so it can get out of the fire, you know, and
Laurie Watson, PhD (16:20.78)
Yeah.
Laurie Watson, PhD (16:28.043)
Mm-hmm. Yeah.
Right.
George (16:34.146)
that often drops the other person. That’s the impact to the other person. rejects them. But I think a lot of which are, is don’t also see what it does to themselves because they walk away from themselves to that part of them that’s threatened to feel safe. They leave alone. They, the place that feels like they’ve gotten a message, they failed that they’ve come up short. Like that place needs something. And when you walk away to feel safe,
Laurie Watson, PhD (16:38.934)
Right.
Laurie Watson, PhD (16:49.761)
Mm-hmm.
George (16:58.548)
You do to yourself, what everyone else does is not show up, not respond, leave that place aside of you alone. And that’s the part we want people to start taking more accountability for. You can still walk away, but walk away in a way that says, know what? I’m going to name this place. I’m going to listen to my body. I can feel in my chest, the heaviness when I hear yet again, I’m coming up short. I’m failing. I’m feeling helpless. Right. And I can make space to respond to that part of myself to say, it does suck when you try so hard to find yourself back here.
Laurie Watson, PhD (17:02.997)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Laurie Watson, PhD (17:20.341)
Mm-hmm.
Laurie Watson, PhD (17:27.827)
Mm-hmm.
George (17:28.098)
to feel sad, to give yourself permission. Like that is caregiving. can give ourselves caregiving when our partner’s not in a space to give it.
Laurie Watson, PhD (17:36.213)
Yeah. So on the inside, show what that would look like. Like, what would you be saying to yourself? Just that? OK.
George (17:42.648)
Well, let’s, let’s role play it. was so fun this week. heard three different couples come up to me who listen to our podcasts and they say, can you please do more of the demos? Like they’re so fun because it takes the theory and it just shows people talking about it. So.
Laurie Watson, PhD (17:49.108)
Hmm.
Laurie Watson, PhD (17:55.735)
I agree. agree. Okay. Well, I’m so glad. Hello, couples. Nice. Nice. Yeah, I do often hear that as well, but nice that you got so much feedback. Okay. Let’s talk about it. Joy and Maria.
George (17:58.371)
But we got to remember to continue to that. Yes.
George (18:08.12)
Yeah. So Joey and Maria, who wants to take accountability? want to take accountability for your anger? You want me to take accountability for my withdrawal? Let’s do both. Right. You go first again, when we set up these conversations to me, there’s three parts. Does the start in the mission, you know, you’re asking the other person for caregiving. You’re making them feel safe. You’re trying to protect them from their threats so they can give you caregiving. Then you’re sharing part two and then the person needs to give caregiving. That’s when we have success.
Laurie Watson, PhD (18:14.645)
Yep, I’ll do it. I’ll do it. I’ll do it.
George (18:37.486)
Right, so we’re trying to line those up.
Laurie Watson, PhD (18:37.783)
But we’re going to do it wrong, right, so that we can show what we need to do for self-regulation.
George (18:44.696)
We might have to just do this one right if we’re to do both of them to have time.
Laurie Watson, PhD (18:47.575)
Okay. So Joey, I really need some support right now. I’m just overwhelmed and I feel like, I don’t know if you could pick up the slack a little bit more. It would really help me.
George (19:05.984)
I’m struggling too, but I hear you’re needing it, so I’m focused on you. can give you caregiving. I’m focused on you.
Laurie Watson, PhD (19:13.119)
Okay, okay. I mean, I just feel like with all the things we’ve got going on with the parties that are coming up, the birthdays, you know, I’m not feeling that well right now and just, you know, struggling to manage it all together. I don’t know, could you, you know, could you manage more grocery runs and picking up and dishes and things like that just whenever you see it?
George (19:40.578)
Yes, I’ll put it more on my radar. I know you’d often don’t ask for help like this and I don’t want you to, you know, drown in this stuff. So whatever my capacity is, I will try without you asking me.
Laurie Watson, PhD (19:53.911)
Wow. Okay. I so appreciate that. That’s awesome. how, okay, G, come back to us. How am I showing people what this means in terms of regulating myself? Okay.
George (20:10.094)
So let me, all right, let me do Joey first. Let’s, so again, it’s just an awareness of self that I’m wanting to share. So Maria, I’m really hoping.
Laurie Watson, PhD (20:21.823)
Okay, let’s Joe, let’s re edit this piece. We’ll use Joey and Joe. that’s okay. Joe. Okay. Why don’t George, you go first, be Joey and let’s see how it sounds.
George (20:32.748)
Yeah, okay. All right. All right, so Maria, I really wanna talk about something I’ve been thinking more about, like how I can focus on me and doing things differently. And I’m really hoping you could just give me care given in this place and…
Laurie Watson, PhD (20:53.441)
Okay.
George (20:54.284)
I’m not sharing this at all to talk about what you’re doing wrong. I’m not trying to kind of reject you. know you, you know, for good reasons that happens in a cycle. I really, just, I need your help. So, you know, I’m starting to notice that I know my withdrawal. I’ve been doing it my whole life and how it does make me feel safe.
Laurie Watson, PhD (21:04.638)
Okay.
George (21:18.094)
But every time I do it, I’m becoming more more aware of the impact. I know it leaves you alone in a moment of need when you’re trying to get me to engage and you’re in a desperate place. And to save myself, I throw you under the bus. And I know that. And it’s still hard sometimes not to do that. And I’m working on that. But I think what I’m also starting to become more aware of is like,
Laurie Watson, PhD (21:36.491)
Yep. Yep.
George (21:45.165)
It happens so fast that when I go away to feel safe and just kind of distract myself, like, I don’t stand up for me. Like, I don’t listen to me. That part of me that’s scared or feels like discouraged, like, I leave alone. And I don’t know, I was just thinking about our son the other day feeling that way. And I feel so bad and yet I’m so used to it. I just do it to myself all the time.
Laurie Watson, PhD (22:11.186)
Mmm.
George (22:11.404)
And I guess that’s what I’m really hoping. Like, I’m not sure what that looks like. I don’t know if you could just maybe afterwards try to help talk about it, but like, just want to be able to not have to always leave myself in that place.
Laurie Watson, PhD (22:26.215)
Gosh honey, it seems like you’re working so hard. I’m trying to understand yourself and I appreciate it so much. You know, I do hate it when you go away or you shut down, but I can see for you there’s a price and you know, you’re not able to figure out what you need and so then you lose too and we both lose. It’s not good.
George (22:51.266)
Yeah. And it’s so easy for me to focus on you or focus on where I need to go, but I need to focus more on me and taking accountability for like, if I keep doing that to myself and my needs don’t get met, I’m never really gonna wanna have these conversations. Like I gotta do me a bit differently.
Laurie Watson, PhD (23:05.335)
Mm-hmm.
Laurie Watson, PhD (23:09.461)
Right. Right. You know, and I know sometimes I will say to you, like, if you take care of your own needs, that automatically means my needs are not going to be met and I’ll get angry or I’ll get frustrated. And so I’m sure that that shuts you down and doesn’t let you talk about what you think you’re needing or even think about it. Because I know when the heat goes up, you kind of freeze in your brain. And I will work really hard at
George (23:38.776)
Thank you.
Laurie Watson, PhD (23:39.467)
you know, keeping their keeping enough space for us so that you can have some thinking time in here.
George (23:48.995)
Thank you for that. It’s almost easier for you to bring up something about you so I could go back to focus in on that instead of listening to this place inside of me. So that would be helpful if you could try to fight for that space for me too. All right.
Laurie Watson, PhD (24:03.733)
Well, awesome. OK, so I want to be Maria, who kind of talks about her escalation and what it feels like. So, Joey, I’ve been thinking about this, and sometimes when you shut me out for whatever reason or minimize me, know, my brain goes from zero to 100 in a millisecond.
George (24:11.788)
Mm-hmm. Yep.
Laurie Watson, PhD (24:33.179)
And I mean, everything in me just says, I want to blurt it out. I want to be angry. I want to yell back at you because I need you so much to get me. But I really do see that that is that hurts you, that that escalates our cycle. And frankly, for me, too, it’s like this kind of like a tantrum inside me as a child. You know, it’s like I feel the right to do it, but
George (24:43.886)
Mm-hmm.
Laurie Watson, PhD (25:02.707)
It is so dysregulating inside and it’s not good for me either. I’m, I’m really going to work on like taking just one breath, just one breath between when I feel shut down and seeing if I can like get a hold of how bad that feels to me. Cause you know, my childhood, I was shut down a lot and I was not attuned to
particularly by my mom. And I just think that that flashes through my body and it happens all over again and it’s not your fault. mean, maybe you were just distracted. Maybe there was nothing that you intended to hurt me, probably most of the time, because I know you love me, but I…
George (25:37.933)
Right.
George (25:47.351)
Yeah, this feels, yeah, it just feels important because I’m so focused on what you’re saying that I’m and I’m going away that I don’t really even know this part of you that is hurting, right? There’s so much noise that we really often don’t get to that. So, you know, I do want to know more about that.
Laurie Watson, PhD (26:04.833)
Right.
Laurie Watson, PhD (26:08.693)
Yeah.
Yeah. Thank you. I appreciate that so much.
Okay, I love that. I think it is such a difficult thing when we want something from our partner. I think what we just demonstrated is the way to explain some of the inner world that we are feeling to our partner, not in a heated moment, you know, just like as we noodle about it and think about it. And then we offer that to our partner. mean, both of those exchanges were so vulnerable.
Maria taking ownership for the part that loses her shit and Joey taking ownership of the part that just shuts down and trying to understand it. First of all, don’t we appreciate both of these people trying to understand themselves? You know, and then offering that to their partner, hey, this what I’ve been thinking about of my contribution to the cycle and how I’m working on it and what I need in this moment from you.
George (27:03.138)
Yeah.
George (27:15.24)
And it’s an assertion of self. mean, when both of us returned to that vulnerable spot, right before we got angry or protected ourselves or walked away, like that’s where we want to return to the body. You know, we want to go back in and listen to that thread and what information is trying to say, because it’s telling us where we need. Right. That’s how we, start to respond better to ourselves and invite our partner into respond to us with caregiving. Like caregiving is what is missing in these places. And a lot of times our partner can’t
Laurie Watson, PhD (27:17.717)
Yeah.
Laurie Watson, PhD (27:24.469)
Yeah. Yeah.
Laurie Watson, PhD (27:34.603)
Mm-hmm.
George (27:45.245)
unless we do our own work to slow ourselves down and send clearer signals. And this is what you saw Joey Maria do.
Laurie Watson, PhD (27:51.938)
Right, and sometimes our partner can’t give us caregiving. And in that moment, what we’re saying is there’s still resource. You can actually give yourself a little bit of understanding and grace and caregiving to help. It would be wonderful in an ideal world if your partner could give it to you, but sometimes we don’t live there and our partner has escalated too.
George (27:59.747)
Yep.
George (28:07.416)
Exactly.
George (28:16.128)
It’s another tool, learning how to give ourselves caregiving. Learn the God to get caregiving. Get it from our partner. The more caregiving we get in this world, the safer it is.
Laurie Watson, PhD (28:19.499)
Yeah. Yeah.
Laurie Watson, PhD (28:26.647)
That’s so true. Okay.
George (28:30.124)
All right. Keep it brave love people.
Laurie Watson, PhD (28:33.761)
Brave love, great sex. This will make better sex, we hope. Okay. Thanks for listening, y’all.
